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RE: End is Near Hopefully - duluth45 - 03-13-2015
No, I didn't misconstrue. I just wanted to emphasize that I didn't mean for any violence to anybody who might have read it that way.
And I hope the jurors are able to put their lives together too and hopefully forget what they had to bear.
Also - I am wanting to learn more about what happened in the trial regarding sidebars and secret meetings in the chambers. If it takes me past April 13, I will continue on.
I am hoping Dr. K writes a book on this trial.
RE: End is Near Hopefully - NERN - 03-13-2015
Good I am glad that all is OK with postings.
Although my intentions are good - I can see me following this case past April 13th. I have no self-control!!
If Dr. K. writes a book - I will most certainly get it!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qa1r4-HpFAw&app=desktop
very interesting interview.
RE: End is Near Hopefully - duluth45 - 03-13-2015
Nern, I just watched the Fox news where Troy Hayden talked for a long time that you posted. I got a lot out of it. I liked the guy and don't understand why some hate him or some don't hate him. He is just doing a reporter's job as I see it. I found it interesting that he said it didn't take him long to pick up that there is something wrong with her and he said at one point he thinks she is mentally ill. I still believe she is inherently evil and if she is mentally ill, regardless she is evil and cruel. He said how she didn't tell all lies to him, that some of the things she said were true. I wish he had said which things she said were true in his opinion. I pay no attention to anything she says even though yes probably some things are true, but with a big liar like Arias, what do you pick and choose, you know? So I discount everything she says. And he seems to think she was telling the truth about her abusive childhood but states that lots of kids have much worse childhoods. I doubt her childhood was as she described, but of course I can't prove it. I believe she lies about everything and sociopaths use the feel sorry for me game all the time. Anyway, thanks for that link. I learned a lot from him. Now I will watch the latest link you posted.
And also - remember that some of Travis's friends said in interviews that they picked up on something odd about her very early on as well.
RE: End is Near Hopefully - NERN - 03-13-2015
Duluth
I think that Arias becomes adept at lying because she throws some "truth" into her stories. But as you say, what can be believed? So we believe nothing she says. Not our problem - it is hers.
The following was just too good to only provide the link, so sorry, it is long but oh so very good.
Just Da Truth!
Friday, March 13, 2015
Jodi Arias: Supporters and Fans—Help or Hindrance?
The recent news that Jodi Arias was put on lockdown for the actions of her supporters comes as no surprise to most people who have been following this trial. While supporters deny their involvement and instead blame 'haters' and Sheriff Joe Arpaio for the severe restriction Jodi was put on earlier this week, it's easy to trace these consequences back to the actions of her most ardent fans and supporters.
Jodi was found to be in violation of several rules put in place for the video visits. The breaking of those rules by Jodi and her supporters resulted in no more video visits, no commissary and a banning of the people involved. That banning will certainly follow Jodi to Perryville where those people will be denied access to Jodi as visitors and later when Perryville goes to video they'll be banned there as well. If those people try to circumvent the rules and use fake IDs again, well then Jodi will suffer even more because now she's on notice to not communicate with those people and she can't deny she didn't know who they are.
Let's look at the reasons Arpaio felt the need to act and restrict Jodi's privileges:
1. Several pictures of Jodi in her cell were posted to social media and then circulated outside of private groups.
Who is to blame? Supporters.
When visitors sign in to the video visitor system they sign an agreement that they will not capture any still or video images, and furthermore they will not circulate any images they take. Right at the get-go supporters know the rules and then they chose to break the rules.
Who do supporters blame? People who leak the photos outside the group and people they call 'haters' who are upset that it appears Jodi, a convicted murderer, is getting special treatment.
The rules are in place for a reason. If supporters chose to ignore the rules then Jodi suffers. They know this yet they continue to break the rules.
The ironic thing is that we constantly see supporters cursing the 'system' because rules aren't followed, but only when they feel the rules are adverse to what they believe.
Most supporters enjoy the luxury of freedom to some degree. Jodi doesn't, even on her best day. She is stuck in a bathroom with a bed all day, every day, for the rest of her life. While supporters can smugly say 'so what, I don't care if Arpaio bans me for 30-days" what they don't take into consideration is that those visits mean far more to Jodi than they do to them—she doesn't have the luxury to hang out in other places until the ban is lifted.
Moving forward Jodi will be under far more scrutiny than ever before. Officers who might turn a blind eye to minor infractions or provide her with small comforts like 9-hours of video will be punished and put on notice. You can only take advantage of a good thing so much before you screw yourself out of it because of greed and entitlement.
2. Felons gamed the system so they could talk to Jodi.
Who is to blame? Supporters.
Again, the video signup explicitly states, along with every jailhouse rulebook, that felons on the outside are not to communicate with felons on the inside. The felons knows these rules, and yet they chose to use fake documents and identities to circumvent the rules. That's how both parties ended up as felons in the first place—disregarding rules and laws.
3. Frauds gamed the system so they could talk to Jodi
Who is to blame? Supporters
Some people used fake credentials to hide their identities. These same people are trying to figure out how they can game the system better the next time around. They can make all the fake accounts they want, it will just get Jodi in trouble—possibly keep her in solitary far longer than she need be, prevent her from having a job, taking classes and other enjoyments inmates who follow the rules enjoy.
4. Children accessed the system to talk to Jodi
Who is to blame? The kids and Jodi
Two 15-year old girls allegedly stole their parents' credit cards and ID and set up an account so they could talk to Jodi. While they were completely in the wrong to do this, Jodi as an adult woman, had the responsibility to shut down the call when she realized children were contacting her. I give Jodi a pass on the felons, because there is no way for her to know the criminal background of supporters, but she certainly knew those girls were underage and anyone with a lick of common sense would know that most likely their parents didn't know.
5. Despite the teens parents forbidding them to talk to Jodi, if was discovered that Jodi was instructing them on how to use other fake IDs to log on.
Who is to blame? Jodi
I find it ironic that people who believe Travis to be a pedophile in part because of a marketing email inadvertently sent to a 9-year old, believe that Jodi has done nothing wrong as she encourages children to break the law—procure fake ID and identities and steal credit cards. It's called "contributing to the delinquency of a minor" and it's a crime.
I have seen several supporters deny that their little Jodi would ever do such a thing, and that Sheriff Joe is lying. Again, everyone is lying but Jodi in their world. I ask supporters this then—what if the Sheriff was to release the tape showing Jodi's conversation with those girls and her instructions on how to break the law? Would that make you think twice about her? Or do you make an excuse because after all she is Princess Jodi, and let her slide?
6. Supporters give Jodi access to social media by showing her Facebook pages and Twitter pages on their computers and transcribing her responses and directives
Who is to blame? Jodi and supporters. Both parties know this is against the rules, but both parties flaunt the rules and continue on. Supporters encourage Jodi's bad behavior by not establishing boundaries and telling her they will not help her break rules that hurt her in the long wrong. So often supporters vie for that 'number 1 fan spot" and throw all their common sense to the wind as they strive to prove to Jodi that they are worthy. When you break the law or break rules so someone will think you're they're friend, the smart thing to do is walk away, not enable the person to destroy themselves
7. Jodi used some means to release the juror list
Who is to blame? If this is true, then not only is Jodi to blame, but so are the people/websites responsible for posting the list. No juror should ever have their private information released without their express permission. I don't care what side they're on or what crimes it's believed they committed, it's wrong. Within hours of the verdict though, the jodiariasisinnocent site posted a list of jurors who voted for the death penalty, and redacted the one person who voted for life.
We know for a fact that the innocent site posted the information, and Jodi's Aunt Sue claims she and Sandy asked them to take it down, and they refused. If the Arias family did ask it to be taken down and the innocent site refused, how does that help Jodi? Publishing that list was never ever going to help Jodi and was a big 'fuck you' to jurors who legitimately found her crime warranted death, but it was a bigger 'fuck you' to Jodi. It was because of that list being published by a site Jodi endorses that it came to the attention of Sheriff Joe and the courts.
I haven't checked for myself, but I'm told as of yesterday the list is still there. This list that put Jodi on severe restriction. This tells me that the administrators of that site don't have Jodi's best interests in mind because if they did they wouldn't have posted it in the first place, and then they would have certainly removed it at the request of her family.
8. Jodi is on record instructing a supporter how to donate to circumvent a civil case being filed by the Alexander family
This kind of behavior shows no remorse on the part of Jodi. It shows greed. While no one relishes a law suit, those who have caused the death of another often feel some responsibility at costs associated with that death. Unless they're a cold blooded murderer. At the very least you'd expect they'd want to pay the funeral expenses, right? Of course the funeral is passed, but reimbursing the family so they can donate the money or even dispurse it amongst themeselves is the kind and compassionate thing to do.
Now let's talk about some of the other issues that supporters do that have a negative impact on Jodi:
1. The site Jodi endorses and the one that boasts it's the number 1 fan site for Jodi, has posted a picture of Travis in a body bag with the caption "justice served". This picture was posted just a couple of weeks ago, and shows up on key dates on the whim of the administers.
The JodiIsInnocent site is the 'face' of Jodi Arias. What happens on that site is seen by the rest of the world as who Jodi is—we are the company we keep, after all. Any self-respecting supporter who truly feels Jodi is innocent or at least not deserving of the death penalty, can't take that site seriously. What they see is a cold and callous response to the death of a man at the hands of a now convicted murderer. If I'm seeking to help Jodi in some way, the last thing I would do is give money to an organization that celebrates the death of the victim.
2. Referencing people who believe Jodi is guilty as "pedo-huggers".
This is actually a term that makes me laugh every single time I see it. If this is truly how supporters feel, then that makes Jodi Arias the biggest "pedo-hugger" around because she claims that not only did she know he was a pedophile, but she loved him despite that glaring flaw, and she would continue having sex with him and wanted to marry him and have children. That not only makes her a pedo-hugger, but it makes Jodi Arias a pedo-lover. While some women are trapped in relationships with pedophiles for reasons most of us can't fathom (financial, children, abuse etc) Jodi had free will and could have removed herself from the situation and reported him, or at least warned his friends with children.
What kind of weak-minded woman do fans support who would prefer the company of a pedophile and allow children to be put in danger? And how weak minded do you have to be to supporter a woman such as this who you have no relationship to? Does that make supporters Pedo-Hugger Lovers?
3. The horrific nasty names and accusations against Travis's family.
I wouldn't wish a murder on any family. It's got to be the scariest, saddest and most devastating crime anyone could suffer through. While most of us can accept a family member dying, none of us can accept a family member being killed. Think about it, and what that really means. The agony this murder has put them through was overwhelming, the viscous lies Jodi has told about their brother has to just kill them.
Many supporters are absolutely gleeful in their abuse of the family. The believe Travis deserved to die and they celebrate it. They believe the family deserves to suffer, and they celebrate that as well.
Some will say 'well haters want to see Jodi die, so this is no different', and yet it's very different. It's different because attacking a grieving family, no matter what the circumstances is wrong, and to do it publicly is insane. It's done on both sides but we're talking about the side that supports Jodi because it directly affects the public perception of her and that affects the decision of people who might otherwise support her.
4. It's never Jodi's fault. This time it's Sheriff Joe's because he wants media attention.
Joe Arpaio doesn't need Jodi Arias for media attention. He's been in office for 23 years and along the way he's found many ways to stay in the media spotlight without any help at all from Jodi Arias. There's a lot to hate about Arpaio, and he doesn't give a damn if you do. Arpaio runs a tight ship. Jodi knows that, she's been with him for 6 1/2 years. She knows exactly what he'll put up with, exactly what the consequences are, and exactly what will get her in hot water. It appears then that it's not Arpaio looking for media attention, it's Jodi, otherwise why all of a sudden would she begin acting out within hours after her life was spared?
Arpaio has been surprisingly tight-lipped about Jodi over the years, releasing very little information unless the media frenzy has reached a point where he has to get involved and make a public statement. He's not going to let any inmate of his get away with shenanigans that make it look like he's not in control. Jodi fucked up. I bet Arpaio didn't know or didn't care that she had all day video visits last Saturday. Instead of being grateful for the privilege (which isn't even afforded to people with far lesser crimes because of the cost and the availability of kiosks) Jodi and her fan crew gave a big 'fuck you' to Joe and the Estrella officers who allowed her that luxury. So Joe took it away. If supporters hadn't posted pictures and the jury list, no one would be the wiser and Jodi would be sitting pretty talking to her felons, frauds and fakes.
Jodi just wrote herself a backstage pass to Perryville's meanest and maddest population with these stunts. All inmates suffer when one flips the bird publicly at the sheriff. It's a pretty good bet that over the last week Sheriff Joe and his officers have cracked down on all inmates—subjecting them to more scrutiny and rules than ever before. Supporters will cry foul because Joe is such mean nasty man, but maybe he wouldn't be this way if the adults who are under his care, and their supporters would follow the rules he's laid down. You can deflect blame all you want—say it was the jail's fault for not having more security measures in place, but guess who pays for those security measures? You. It's like a dollar a minute or more to use the video system, right? Far too expensive for most inmate families to afford, but they make the sacrifice so children can talk to their incarcerated parents, so hospitalized or dying family members can share their grief and unity, so inmates incarcerated in Arizona can see their family in Northern California, perhaps even say goodbye face-to-face with their father before he dies... Supporters complain about the cost, but perhaps if everyone followed the rules and didn't ruin it for everyone else, it might be more affordable. How much more will those calls cost families struggling to make ends meet?
Jodi's a month away from Perryville. They don't have video visits yet, but there are surely inmates who can't wait for them. There are many lifers in Perryville and they may never see a family member again other than video—how happy are they going to be when the person that caused even more rules and restrictions prances in?
5. Supporters are constantly saying "I hope the Arizona taxpayers are mad about the cost of this trial because it's all Juan Martinez's fault".
The defense is said to have spent $3 million dollars defending Jodi Arias. The prosecution is said to have spent almost $200,00. That's a big discrepancy and is likely because Jodi's defense team pulls in $250-300 dollar in billable hours and they paid big bucks to their expert witnesses. The prosecutor is on salary and so their costs will always be significantly less than defense spending on wages.
Would supporters be happy if Jodi's defense spending was more in line with the prosecution spending? Would she be happy with a $200,000 defense? Shouldn't no expense be spared in a death penalty case? How much would supporters scream and kick if Jodi's defense spending was capped out at 10% of the actual cost?
Juan Martinez didn't cause Jodi to lie about the killing for the first two years and claim it was intruders, did he? How much time and money did Jodi waste on those 2 years? What about all the experts the defense called in who ran tests at the rate of over $200 per hour, all on bogus information? We know Samuels and LaViolette and the other psychologist (who never took the stand) were working with Jodi while the intruder story was front and center.
Juan Martinez is not responsible for the cost of the trial. Jodi Arias is. The fine people of Arizona thought her life was worth enough that they wanted her to have a fair trial and were willing to pay for it. You may dispute the 'fair trial' but you can't despute the fact that at least she was given significant resources to mount a defense, far in excess of what most people are afforded.
In addition, Jodi led her defense team on a wild goose chase and they had to go through several therapists (I heard it was 5) before they found anyone willing to testify on her behalf. She lied about evidence, causing her team to seek out evidence that never existed. All that costs money. That's Jodi's fault.
6. Jodi is so strong and amazing—nothing gets her down in solitary–she's always so sweet and calm...
If you say this to yourself, then you don't recognize mental illness. No one of sound mental health has ever done well in solitary. Either it's all a facade, or she's a psycho/sociopath. It's ok to be depressed and angry and frustrated and sad while being locked down 23/7. There will be times she's better than others, but if she's happy in solitary or she's having a grand old time, that should prove to you that there is something very wrong with her. Solitary is brutal and is completely adverse to a healthy lifestyle and outlook. If you walk in as a mentally healthy individual, you're not going to walk out 2 years later as one. By putting her on a pedestal and commending her for her strength you're de-humanizing her. Are you forcing her to act the part of the martyr to appease your sense of what a hero looks like? Are you seeking to portray her as this mythical heroine to show "nobody will break our Jodi"? Because all you do is dehumanize her and for people looking in seeing how happy she appears, it makes her more of a monster. There are many people who want her to suffer, and it's ok to let them know she's suffering, what does she care? Supporters encourage her to internalize her feelings so she can be their hero and eventually she will blow...it's happened before, right?
At the end of the day, Jodi Arias is on restriction because of the actions of her supporters. These supporters do far more harm than good as they enable Jodi's bad behavior and sense of entitlement. Do you want to know if you're being manipulating by a convict, ask yourself these questions:
1. Am I being guilted into doing something I know is wrong?
2. Am I being asked to do things that I know will harm the manipulator but I do them anyway so they will continue to see me as a friend?
3. When I push back and tell the person I won't do what they want and point out the consequences, do they accuse me of betrayal and bad mouth me to others?
4. Do I feel guilty when indulging in bad behavior but do it anyone so the manipulator will like me?
5. Am I afraid to voice my own opinions that differ from the manipulator's because they will shun me or cause others to ignore me?
6. Am I made to feel guilty because I have freedom and resources to do what I want?
7. Am I made to feel loved and important when I do things I know will bring consequences to both of us?
8. Is my good advice ignored and I'm forced to go along with whatever the manipulator says is the right path, despite all the flaws I point out?
9. Do I ignore or make excuses for all the manipulators bad behavior even though in my heart I know they're true but I fear rejection if I voice or act any other way?
10. Am I sometimes or often appalled by what the manipulator asks of me and fear I'm in too deep?
11. Have I become afraid of the manipulator and no longer want contact but fear pulling away because I know what they're capable of?
12. Have I realized the truth about the manipulator—realize that she's lied to me all along, that she may have betrayed me, but I still 'support' her because I don't know how to break away?
I wonder if Jodi's own family can't wait for many of the supporters to go away. They're known Jodi all their lives, they likely see the supporters enabling the same behavior that got Jodi in this mess in the first place. I've heard som supporters have been downright rude and disrespectful to the family, but the family is at their mercy because no one else will support their daughter. If I was a family member I'd be furious with people who claim to be compassionate and mature being anything but. I would be furious that some people were obviously supporting Jodi for secondary gain and there was nothing I could do about it.
If people truly support Jodi and have her best interests at heart, maybe the kindest thing to do for her is walk away and not be a part of the problem. There are many people who truly do help her and her family–most of these people we don't even see because their involvement doesn't make waves or cause problems. Those are the people who can truly be called "supporters", the rest, including those who were banned can only be called "fans".
http://justdatruth2012.blogspot.ca/2015/03/jodi-arias-supporters-and-fanshelp-or.html
RE: End is Near Hopefully - duluth45 - 03-13-2015
The interview with Cassandra is good too. I had a thought. I think it's possible that Arias has more money available to her now than she ever did all those years she worked as a waitress. If that is the case, it is disgusting.
RE: End is Near Hopefully - Lunarscope - 03-13-2015
(03-13-2015, 06:43 PM)NERN Wrote: Good I am glad that all is OK with postings.
Although my intentions are good - I can see me following this case past April 13th. I have no self-control!!
If Dr. K. writes a book - I will most certainly get it!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qa1r4-HpFAw&app=desktop
very interesting interview.
I'm also wanting DR. K's book, and hope a article or two, watching again Cassandra in that video link has proved her mindsets ability, the one male specialist went into early attack mode, Dr. Drew removed him. She was to explain the JII connection but didn't. Whereas she was a Nurse their are additional medications she needed, she has issues plus has assorted petty crimes, just in a jail not convicted! JDT tried to get her to join our board and we even created a thread for him to ask her questions, she was worried about confrontation.
I believe her in the most part, recognising certain limitations.
What I accepted was her supporting my assumptions' not using her assessment as a base for building my convictions.
The FBI part was likely fabricated and that impacted her credibility, more so when her police record has stupid thefts repeated.
But I believe she is justifiably afraid of Jodi and that her goal was to be honest in the interview, the specialist were against her before she spoke, and Dr.Drew gave them airtime not letting the story be told.
RE: End is Near Hopefully - NERN - 03-13-2015
Casandra may have her own issues, but for the most part, I think she pegged Arias extremely well. Knowing Arias, I bet a lot of what Casandra said was true.
(03-13-2015, 07:27 PM)duluth45 Wrote: The interview with Cassandra is good too. I had a thought. I think it's possible that Arias has more money available to her now than she ever did all those years she worked as a waitress. If that is the case, it is disgusting.
If it is indeed true and it probably is because she lived off of other people when she was free, it is disgusting, however, I have faith they will find most of it or at least stop it coming in.
RE: End is Near Hopefully - Lunarscope - 03-13-2015
(03-13-2015, 07:27 PM)duluth45 Wrote: The interview with Cassandra is good too. I had a thought. I think it's possible that Arias has more money available to her now than she ever did all those years she worked as a waitress. If that is the case, it is disgusting.
I want Jodi yearly earning report, she could get hired, but stalking was more important than keeping a job, I bet she would be made part-time hours, Jodi was often borrowing money or behind on paying bills, I wonder if she sold herself myself, $100.00 a week for snacks times 3 years is likely equal to her lifetimes earnings!
I would be surprised if Jodi's .mother speaks for her on the 13th and wonder if her parents even show-up, her siblings would also have a hard time. Actually so sad, a island to be forgotten' just because she wanted the impossible mate!
I just wanted to share Cassandra's shortcomings' to explain how many accredit her, I find her credible' but keep a eye out for confusion!
Dr.Drew lost some of my respect for having so many professionals gang up on her, when he new she had limitations in his field of expertise, who his guest were and the amount there were overwhelming, should have called her back for a one on one talk or apologized on the air!
RE: End is Near Hopefully - Justice - 03-13-2015
I watched the interview and questions/answers by Troy Hayden. One thing he said, but was careful not to mentions what all the 'infractions' were, he said they have notebooks filled with records of her 'infractions, what her restrictions were over the years at Estrella Jail. He showed, (using his hands) the stack height to be what appeared as an 8 to 10 inch high stack. That would be a lot of infractions.
He also said that after she is actually sentenced and shipped off to Perryville, it would not surprise him if much, much more doesn't come out about her and her shennanigans. He expects that there will be much more told that we do not even know about. Whatever he learned during his talks with Sheriff Joe, he must have been instructed by the Sheriff about not telling 'too much'. I can respect that. I think he knows a lot more than we all do, but honestly, I put nothing past Arias.
She is a seasoned con artist, a prolific liar, an expert at 'masquerading' and changing her looks, her demeaner, and her manipulations. She is, in my opinion, very near the top when discussing criminal minds and could rank as a mafia 'daddy' if she had been a male. I see her as a possible 'mafia or mobster mama'. She seems well acquainted with 'how to get away' with things she should not do, and does them anyway, always having some under her 'rule' who 'carry out her commands'. Most of them do this happily, it seems to me, simply because they just yearn for the privilege of 'being connected to her' in some way...any way, it appears.
I will be very disappointed if the Judge gives her a 25 year term. Judge Stephens has witnessed all the lies, the deception, the lack of remorse, and is privy to more than we know about Jodi Arias. You can be sure Sheriff Joe will pass along that big stack of 'infractions' done by her over the past years. He said himself that, "she seems to be 'escalating' her rule breaking actions lately." She has learned from her experiences at the jail, but not in a good way. She has learned how to 'get away' with more and more and is more blatant with her rule breaking. THAT is what she has learned. She thrives on 'getting away' with whatever she can.
RE: End is Near Hopefully - Lunarscope - 03-13-2015
This is the still camera view of trial that's going to be released, It's news with clips of Jodi!
http://www.kpho.com/story/28428030/video-of-jodi-arias-secret-testimony-released